Hwy. 65 just isn’t what it used to be
Posted on April 20th, 2008 – 10:47 PMBy Roadguy
Here’s Roadguy’s column from the Sunday paper. If you’ve already read it elsewhere, please skip on down to the comments below. Thanks.
A SHORTENED ROAD
Alert reader Sharon, unhappy when her out-of-town visitors became lost, has a question about a highway that is no longer where she thinks it is:
When you are traveling north on 35W [near the Convention Center], you see exit signs for downtown Minneapolis indicating that it is also the exit for Hwy. 65. Those of us who live northeast of downtown all know that Hwy. 65 continues out of downtown over the Third Avenue Bridge and is the same as Central Avenue through northeast Minneapolis.
However, once you take that exit, there are no signs downtown to indicate that if you want to follow Hwy. 65, you need to turn left on Washington and right on 3rd Avenue.
Hwy. 65 is actually no longer mentioned on the “downtown exits” signs, but Roadguy, like Sharon, was not aware that the road had been officially shortened. The state still considers the Third Avenue Bridge and points north to be Hwy. 65, but the downtown portion has been turned over to the city.
However, the freeway portion, which connects downtown to 35W, is still maintained by the state and has mile markers that say Hwy. 65. Those were left in place to help stranded motorists and emergency responders because it’s tough to locate vehicles on a road with no name.
LANE GAMES
Alert reader S. has a question about lanes:
I’ve been puzzled about just how many lanes Lyndale Avenue officially has beginning at about 31st Street and heading south. Because cars can park on both sides of the street, it ends up being big enough for about 1.5 lanes in each direction. Some people seem to treat it like it has two full lanes. … There are no lines to give guidance, either.
Roadguy has been tempted to take a paintbrush to that stretch of Lyndale for quite some time. But county officials say the road was never striped because they didn’t want to encourage people to drive in lanes that often have parked cars in them, or to drive side by side where there’s a less-than-optimal amount of room.
Drivers have been doing those things anyway, but a solution is coming: Starting this summer and continuing through 2009, Lyndale will be rebuilt from 31st Street to 50th Street. (The official contruction info page is here.) The new medians, turn lanes and bumpouts should make it very clear where everyone should be.
Southwest Minneapolis drivers who are already feeling trapped by the Crosstown Commons project might want to rent a helicopter from June to November, when Lyndale will be closed to through traffic between 38th and 50th Streets.
PARKING-RAMP PATIENCE
We conclude today with a quick Minnetonka question from alert reader Shawn:
What is up with the unfinished look of the parking ramp at Hopkins Crossroad and 394? On the 394 side it has a very unfinished look compared to the other sides.
Bob Gibbons of Metro Transit has a logical answer: “The ramp is not yet complete.” Work should resume this summer and be done by October.
22 Responses to "Hwy. 65 just isn’t what it used to be"
I have found that MnDOT loves sparing extra signage if they think they can get away with it. Additionally, Highway 65 isn’t the only road to have a stretch turned over to the city in downtown Minneapolis. MN Highway 55 is the same way.
Highway 55 now technically runs along I-94 from the intersection at Olson Memorial Highway to the interchange at Hiawatha Avenue. Any city streets that used to be part of Hwy. 55 between those interchanges reverted back to the city.
If you’re coming into Minneapolis on EB 55, you’re directed onto EB 94 to stay on Hwy. 55, but I-94 is not dual signed (just like it’s not dual signed with EB US-12 until you get to Wisconsin). I don’t recall if the signs on NB/WB Hiawatha indicate that Hwy. 55 continues onto WB 94 (though I tend to recall that they do not), but again I-94 is not dual signed. The only indication on I-94 that Highway 55 doesn’t run into downtown is that the exit from EB 94 to Olson Highway now has the directional “West” added to the Highway 55 sign.
Technically, if all the dual signing were to be implemented, the stretch of I-94 from 394 to Hiawatha would by EB I-94/EB US 12/EB US 52/EB MN 55. Something similar exists in Wisconsin, where part of the Madison beltway is signed with 4 US highways (US 12/14/18/151).
Another note about signage involving Highway 55… If you’re on Hwy. 62 Crosstown eastbound as you get to Hiawatha Avenue, there is a small sign that the Hwy. 62 designation ends there, but no indication that it becomes EB Highway 55 until 3/4 mile later as you approach Highway 5.
The Lyndale thing is interesting. I have a hard time with that road. Just because there are signs that prohibit parking during rush hour, people assume that means there are two lanes there. Well, it is more like 1.5 lanes, and it isn’t striped. So, I just stay to the left of the lane(s) and if people want to make a lane next to me on the right, so be it.
This isn’t the only road like this.
50th in Edina between 100 and east to France is even worse. There are two lanes east of 100 for a few blocks, then there is a merge sign BUT there are also “No Parking” signs during rush hour, so do you merge unless it’s rush hour and then it’s two lanes? Who knows!
When I lived in Cincinnati, there were signs that would say “Right lane ends, merge left except 7-9am Mon-Fri.” Those signs were wordy, but they made more sense.
When I used to drive on Lyndale South I’d treat it like it was one lane both ways. Cars are parking along the curb and judging from the width of the driving lanes, it’s big enough for one car (and then some), but not for two cars.
Today’s drivers are in a hurry everyday and you’re always going to see some driver that wants to be in front of the car in front of them.
50th Street is terrible. Drivers never drive the posted speed on that street. It’s in a residential area and drivers don’t care that people are trying to get from Point A to Point B.
Thank you for addressing the Lyndale “1.5 lane” debacle! There is definitely not enough room to comfortable hold two cars abreast there, and I’m glad I have some answers on it.
One question, though: What’s a “bumpout”?
“Southwest Minneapolis drivers who are already feeling trapped by the Crosstown Commons project might want to rent a helicopter from June to November, when Lyndale will be closed to through traffic between 38th and 50th Streets.”
No truer words have ever been spoken. It’s absolutely ridiculous how hard it is to get out of that area and go east. I have to go west to Xerxes or weave through city streets all the way to Portland (and cross 35W somehow!) to get on 62 east. Getting onto 35W is a nightmare and every time I use Diamond Lake Road, I fear for my suspension — assuming I don’t get squished in traffic. Getting from 50th to 35th/36th on Nicollet is already a mess, so with Lyndale blocked off…oh man. I can’t wait.
SeanG- bumpouts are little bits of non-street that bump into the street, typically at corners. The idea is to narrow the street, which is supposed to be a visual clue to drivers to slow down. The bumps also keep people from parking too close to the corner, so there’s better corner visibility. Lastly, they reduce street width, which reduces pedestrians’ exposure to traffic.
Restriping & bumping Lyndale will certainly lower traffic volume, which’ll be good for Lyndale residents. But I’m curious about where the extra traffic will go instead? Perhaps Bryant will see traffic volume rise, but there aren’t a lot of alternatives to Lyndale in that area.
Lastly, anyone know how long the 50th street bridge & Minnehaha Pkwy underpasses will be closed for traffic crossing 35W? Tangletown might be a literal traffic tangle this summer…
I wrote up a little article about the turn-back of the routes through downtown back in ‘06 when I first noticed the blank spots on the exit signs around downtown. I think the info in the article is still accurate - I guess not much has changed in 2 years! I wonder when MnDOT will finally get around to marking the westbound 55 connection via 94?
Article Link: http://www.deadpioneer.com/articles/wheres55.htm
The 50th street bridge is way behind schedule. It was originally supposed to be done last Nov. Then they postponed it until spring but said it would be back before they took out the 46th St bridge. Now it won’t be done until fall 08 but they’re taking out the 46th St bridge this summer.
bsimon:
Minnehaha is supposed to be open by Friday, right before they take down the bridge at 46th. They claim that the 50th street bridge should be open in the fall, and 46th will be done next spring.
According to the plans for the Lyndale reconstruction on the Hennepin County website, none of the bumpouts are at intersections, so they will be of little use to pedestrians. Most of the bumpouts in this project seem to delineate parking and force lane shifts.
bsimon, Thanks a bunch!
Also: What is the deal with the Lake St. construction? Will it continue west until it gets to Lake Calhoun?
35W / 62 are under construction. So what does Minneapolis do? Tears up Lyndale Ave, a major alternative north/south route. What they should do is make it a decent 4 lanes wide, and not allow parking, that would be progress. My guess is that they will make it 3 lanes wide, and use the center lane for left turns.
There is no 50th St bridge, and soon no 46th St bridge. It is difficult to go under 35W on 60 th st, Nicollet, and Lyndale. All the traffic is on Diamond Lake Road. It’s grid locked at Diamond Lake and Nicollet - cause of three traffic lights within 2 blocks. Oh the wisdom of our street planners.
Richfield (in their infinite wisdom) is going to replace the 76th st bridge - removing yet another east/west alternative.
We need some real leadership.
I don’t think Richfield has achoice in the matter of the 76th st. bridge. It doesn’t meet clearance regulations.
If you caught Roadguy’s article in Saturday’s paper, you’ll see that American Blvd. over 35W in Bloomington is also closed until May 2nd. So both it and 76th will be closed at the same time for a week. This means more traffic getting onto EB 494, which means a greater likelihood of an accident on that dangerous crossover that is the Penn Avenue on-ramp/SB 35W off-ramp.
So lets see… you can’t get on EB 62 Crosstown from Penn, you can’t get on NB 35W from 66th Street, and you can’t cross 35W at 76th Street. How much more difficult can MnDOT make it to try to get from western Richfield onto NB 35W? What a pain…
bsimon, apparently there are quite a few people on Lake St that see these bumpouts as prime parking spots. Don’t get me wrong, I think they are a good idea.
DGB why should they make Lyndale 4 lanes? To make it less inviting for pedestrians?
A long time ago, a major mistake was made with the physical layout / width of streets in Mpls and St Paul. Same for the lot sizes.
Lyndale Ave is a County Highway. It is an important secondary artery. It should be 4 lanes - no parking.
The reason traffic is so bad in Minneapoils is that we don’t have enough secondary roads. And even when we get a good one (like Hiawatha) it’s wrecked by the LRT.
Why can’t thru traffic just use 35W?
Also, I grew up in Lakeville, and I rather like the streets and lots in Minneapolis.
Matt:
I ‘live’ in Minneapoils. I think I should be able to drive down a city street and get to a destination in a reasonable and comfortable time. As long as I’ve lived in Mpls (30 yrs) Lyndale Ave has been a PITA.
All I can say is that you fly-over country people make the state what it is: fly-over country. I can’t figure out how a bunch of socialist got here but that’s what the rest of the nation percieves this state as - and I think it’s a valid POV.
DGB,
Small correction: “rest of the nation” = “you”
SeanG: Believe me the rest of the US (east and west coasts) considers this as fly-over country. In the 80’s - 90’s I thought they were wrong. But lately, with all the socialist leanings, the awful, awful highway system that appears will never be fixed, Minnesota has regressed into the hick state that is was percived to be in the early 80’s.
Actually, I bet those enlightened people on the coasts would perceive us to be hick if we *didn’t* work on a multimodal transportation system.
So you want us *not* to be flyover land, but you don’t want us to act like a big city when it comes to transportation planning?
Hmmm…
Des Moines. Bloomington. Wichita. St. Paul. Sioux Falls. Minneapolis. Omaha.
Good company, not.
