Money numbers
Posted on July 24th, 2008 – 1:31 PMBy Jerry Zgoda
Ok, here they are: Sebastian Telfair’s three-year deal is worth $7.5 million and breaks down this way: $2.3 million this coming season, $2.5 million in 2009-2010 and he has the option to come back in 2010-2011 for $2.7 million. Craig Smith signed a two-year deal worth $4.8 million that will pay him $2.3 million and $2.5 million a season.
Also, the Wolves appear to be getting closer to signing Ryan Gomes. If they do, it’ll probably be somewhere in the $3 million a year range. As the days go by, it looks less and less likely he’s going to get a sizable offer from another team. If he does and the Wolves don’t match, look for them to sign a lower level free agent who can defend bigger small forwards such as LeBron James.
Randy Wittman also appears close to adding Houston Rockets player personnel guy Dean Cooper to his coaching staff to replace Bob Ociepka, who joined Vinny Del Negro’s staff with the Bulls in Bob’s hometown of Chicago. Cooper has been with the Rockets for nine seasons as a video coordinator, assistant coach, scout and last season was vice president of player personnel. He’s from Michigan originally and played college ball at Aquinas College in Grand Rapids, Mich.
48 Responses to "Money numbers"
I am assuming that Telfair demanded the player option for year 3. I would have prefered the team option or just a 2 year deal but beggers can’t be choosers. I think Smith is vastly overpaid. I don’t think he is a very good fit with this team. After they sign Gomes I don’t see Smith getting a lot of minutes either.
Thanks for the updates on the numbers Jerry. Did the Strib send you out to Vegas?
With those type of numbers for the Telfair deal, it looks like a good deal for the Wolves. Bassy was in no way worth $3.5 Mil/per so McHale played this situation perfectly by letting him test the unrestricted market then signing him for his actual value.
That’s great news about Gomes and $3 Mil seems to be a decent figure for him
I agree that smith will have a diminished role, but I don’t think he is treally overpaid.. He’s a valuable guy off the bench and he gives good minutes. Turiuf is getting 4 million per.. I think they are comparable and smith is making much less. Good signing by McHale for once.. Well telfairs is good too… so maybe he’s learned how to better gauge a players value, and it one took a decade and some change!
jama…. totally agree about Smith. With Gomes hopefully coming back he doesn’t seem to fit very well anywhere. At least the Smith deal is only 2 years.
Hopefully they resign Gomes then realize Richards doesn’t deserve a contract as much as Ahern/Jeter.
Jama, yes, I went to Vegas for four days early on during summer league. I don’t know if Telfair “demanded” that third year, but his agent probably said his guy was going to be a big-money player by then and the Wolves probably said, Ok, it’s your option to come back, to get the deal done.
Hey jerry what do you think about what mchale said towards the end of his statement at the telfair press conference. In which he said something along the lines of “we’ve still got a couple of moves to make” …. I didn’t percieve him to be talking about resigning more free agents.. What do you think he might be looking at right now as far as a trade or other free agent signing?
Hey jerry what do you think about what mchale said towards the end of his statement at the telfair press conference. In which he said something along the lines of “we’ve still got a couple of moves to make” …. I didn’t percieve him to be talking about resigning more free agents.. Have you heard anything that supports the idea that he might be looking at some kind of trade or other free agent signing?
That may be a tough question to answer given mchales secretiveness. But I hope we can add something more soon
About having moves to make… if he resigns Chris Richard and Ryan Gomes, that’s 16 contracts I believe. And I think he wants to bring in Blake Ahearn so we have depth at PG/SG.
That may mean buyouts. Calvin Booth will be the first to go. Cardinal is probaby a suspect aswell, but his deal is too heft to buy him out IMO, unless he’ll be a distraction like T-Hud.
I think they’re talking trades, as they always do, but it doesn’t sound like there’s anything close. As a mentioned above, they’ll probably sign somebody who can defend big small forwards if they don’t re-sign Gomes. I would think it’s likely Booth’s contract will be bought out. Cardinal has too much money left and, from all accounts, will be terrific in the locker room if he plays or not. Plus he’s just one extra guy who can shoot it a little bit if they get a rash of injuries. I’m also starting to worry if they’re getting worried about Corey Brewer’s development, based on his summer-league play. I remember one of the first moves McHale made years ago was trading Donyell Marshall for Tom Gugliotta under Red Auerbach’s theory that the benefit to having a player is you get to see his warts before everybody else does. I’m not saying they’re going to do that with Brewer (the difference here is that McHale drafted Brewer, Jack McCloskey drafted Donyell), I’m just saying his offensive struggles at times against summer-league competition is worrisome. Still, he’s too good and too unique of a defender. Way too soon to give up on him, IMO.
Craig Smith got a little more than I think he is worth, but at least the contract is not a long-term killer. Plus, I don’t mind keeping him as an asset. If you want to make a trade, he could be an attractive add-on player. So, you have a guy like him, some expiring contracts coming up and the picks. What they are able to do with it, we’ll see. But at least it is something better than the past few years.
Remember Gary Trent? He was around for several seasons. McHale must love the tweener forward who can score in the post. I like Smith. There will be games where his points off the bench will prove great value, especially now playing off a guy like Kevin Love. In Smith’s rookie year, he played well off Kevin Garnett.
Wondering how the new guy from Houston, Dean Cooper, will fit into the brain trust at Target given his front office background. Anybody have any quotes from him about why he’s making the switch?
Maybe its time to give Taylor some props for loosening McHale’s stranglehold on decision making and expanding the circle of discussion.
Either that or McH got a brain transplant regarding the idea that spending other people’s money carries a lot of responsiblity. These new contracts seem rewsonable.
I think that the Smith signing was a good deal. If you look at his numbers alone he is kind of inconsistent, but when he did step it up was when we needed him to. You could make the argument that we needed him to step it up every game last year but every player needed to play better. Smith is a very good offensive rebounder and can give us a low post scorer when Love and Jefferson are resting. He is kind of short for the PF position in the NBA but he more than makes up for it with is incredible strength down low. That is my two cents.
The wolves have made all the right moves this summer, its good to see for a change. The Chalmers trade isn’t as painful to think about now that we signed telfair back. Telfair is going to get a lot of minutes this year being the only true point guard on the team. He’s going to keep getting better as long as he keeps getting extended minutes. Were going to have much better depth next year with telfair, McCants, Brewer, Smith, and Collins all being nice pieces to bring off the bench. I’m not saying were going to, but I wouldn’t be surprised if we slipped into the eight seed next year. It’s obviously improbable but I think theres a chance.
Brewer really has to be moved, even if only for a late-first, early-second. He is absolutely terrible. He has no offense whatsoever, and his defense is highly overrated. Please get rid of the rest of the dead wood so this rebuilding can move forward. Brewer must go now…
Don’t give up on Brewer; a jump shot is all he needs (he’s got one of the best in Hoiberg teaching him; its only a matter of time) and once he and Love get their chemistry working I foresee quite a bit of run-and-gun between the 2 first rounders this coming year.
Booth is a nice piece that they should seriously consider dealing for a future pick or at least cash considerations; he’d be a nice bench piece but we already have Collins and I really liked Pops in the summer league (any way we can grab him instead of Richards?).
Speaking of Richards - why can’t he get it right? He’s a monster but plays like a small forward. He had all that time in the DL last year but doesn’t seem to have improved. I say we keep in in the DL one more year or drop him and work with a combination of pops, smith, gomes (if he’s at 3 Mil, snag him), and Cardinal at the 4.
I wish we got to see Carney in action - the guy is supposed to be electrifying but also seems injury prone. He also seems like a piece we can deal to get that 2nd (Foye being the 1st one) combo guard that McHale covets (although I want to at least see what the kid’s got before we do that).
Overall, they will give up quite a bit of points but they’ll score quite a bit more as well - 16 ppg from Miller, 20 ppg from Jefferson and 18-20 ppg potential from Love and Foye make for a fun team.
twa:
I wouldn’t say Brewer’s defense is overrated. Defense really is the Wolves weak spot right now, so it doesn’t make much sense to get rid of their best defender.
The wolves will be hurting if little corybrewer is there best defender.
So, anyone think that Bassy’s cousin is going to produce 10x as much on the court this season?
Does anyone know if the Wolves actually have interest in signing Pops? I think there seems to be a consensus He is better than Chris Richard. I watched some of his interviews on NBA.com and this kid has a great attitude, wants to be with the Wolves and is only going to improve.
Richards looks like he could care less if he plays or not…he needs to get hungry and play like an animal….
Pops is not a kid. He has been out of college for several years.
Can someone please, for the first time, tell me what a true point guard is? People keep saying this but don’t give a definition of what this means. Maybe a couple of examples would help me out too!
Brewer is a good defender on the perimeter but he can’t handle a lot of the SF’s in the league. Until he puts on about 20 lbs there is no way I want him guarding a guy like LeBron or McGrady. As of right now he really is only suited to guard SG’s because of his lack of strength.
Am I the only person who thinks Calvin Booth actually has some value as a bench player? I realize that he only plays one end–defense–but that’s the end where The Rhino (Craig Smith) is so limited. They could complement one another quite well for the 12 minutes per game when Love and Big Al aren’t on the floor.
Booth has always had GREAT blocked shot numbers (in recent years, you have to compare his Blocks per 48 minutes because he doesn’t get much run). Last year, at the age of 31, his Blocks per 48 ranked 10th in the entire NBA.
Quite honestly, I’d much prefer Booth to Collins as a backup center. If you look at John Hollinger’s Player Efficiency Ratings on espn.com, Calvin Booth has been doing more with his minutes than Jason Collins for each of the past five years.
I’m quite happy with Booth and The Rhino backing up Love and Big Al. I also see Gomes backing up Brewer, so I don’t think he really belongs in the power forward rotation conversation.
If booth can be a sturdier version of that one guy who couldnt stay health last year (cough) then maybe we should keep him instead. that said, i would prefer pops as the guy looks pretty awesome (and has a cool name). Imagine having this size of a lineup - foye, miller/mccants, gomes/brewer, jefferson, love with big guys like collins/booth/cardinal/smith coming off the bench. We should rebound very well at least.
The kid has millions of reasons to be happy! Who wouldn’t be? Millions and millions to play a game? How good is that?
I doubt Smith could have received the same money on the open market, but I’m happy he has another year here to develop. I think having more talent around him on the second unit will allow his freakish offensive gifts to shine a bit more.
Telfair’s contract is quite reasonable.
Gomes, if they can get him for $3 mil a year, would also be a reasonable price. Good luck finding that guy who can guard LeBron, though.
Yes, McHale seems to have learned from the Hudson/Hassell/Jaric contracts. What’s going on?
Fortunately Smith’s contract is only for two years, so we can clear him off the books by summer 2010 if we choose to. Also, the figures make him pretty tradable.
Bassy I think is a very very reasonable contract, even with the third year option. $2.7 for one year isn’t bad at all unless we’re over the luxury tax (and I can’t see how we would be by then). And in all honesty, if he keeps progressing we’ll want to have him around anyway.
Telfair was signed to an adequate contract. Craig Smith was a terrible resign for that kind of money. If they sign Gomes… Smith is going to be a 3rd stringer for the most part.
jama and BC Beneke -
gomes and smith don’t overlap in minutes or skillset. gomes is a “big” SF with range and little post up game and smith is a “undersized” PF with great post up game and no range. they both have a defined role on the team and played those roles well last year. smith is low post scoring off the bench, gomes is a spot starter/rotation SF and glue guy.
i like the telfair and smith contracts. bassy has a reasonable contract that he can parlay into something bigger with a solid 2-3 year run with the wolves. smith earns about what chuck hayes from houston makes and what paul milsap from utah is about to be paid and has similar production. plus he is a fun guy to watch and wants to be here.
gomes at 3mil is about right for what he brings, as long as the length is kept to 3yrs. this teams salary structure is finally making some sense and results on the court can’t be far behind…
jama-
right there with you on the “true” point guard arguement. i’ve been posting the same thing for quite some time and no one has a good answer.
since each team has a different philosophy on how the offense should be run, a “true” point guard is impossible to define. thats why there is the term “point-forward”; for guys like lamar odom and lebron james who can set and run an offense from the SF/PF position. we had a guy once, i think he wore #21, who ran our offense from the PF position. he was pretty good at it too.
If Gomes and Smith were the only players you had, there wouldn’t much overlap, true. But given the other makeup of this team, there isn’t really a place. Jefferson and Love are going to eat up the minutes at PF. Gomes will lose the regular minutes he played at PF last year, and go into the mix with Brewer and Miller at SF. Where does Smith play — maybe a few minutes if Jefferson or Love get in foul trouble and the coaches decide to go with him as opposed to playing Gomes there (or Madsen or Cardinal).
How can you guys be bagging on Smith and his contract. It is hard to find a non rookie big man that doesn’t make at least 2.5 million and most of those are more like Richard than Smith. Also Smith can be very good at what he does and I think will be able to improve. As far as there not being mins for smith he will be the top 4/5 off the bench and probably the only one that will get consistent mins. Collins, Booth, Madsen, and Richard are all going to have a harder time finding mins than Smith. You have to remember that there is 96 mins for the 4/5 positions and Jefferson will play 40, Love will play 30 and Smith will play 20 and some combo of the rest of the crap on the roster will play the other 16. Finding time for Smith is less of question than finding time for all the small forwards and who is going to be the SG. Also where is this mystical combo guard going to play if Mchale gets his wish.
Collins is going to be the top guy off the bench at those spots because he’s got legitimate size for the center position and can play something resembling NBA-caliber defense.
You also should take account that injuries occur in professional sports. It’s not out of the question - knock on wood - someone on the front line gets hurt and is out for a significant amount of time.
You want quality depth and Craig Smith can step-up if someone gets hurt and the same with Ryan Gomes or Sebastian Telfair. Remember Craig Smith was the man at Boston College and this is his only his third season with the Wolves.
I agree with Sean that Collins is already penciled in as the first big off the bench. He can come in and either replace Al at Center or replace Love and you then move Al to PF.
I understand what Smith can do but he played 20 minutes per game last year and the Wolves have added 2 more front court players. Why would you expect his minutes to stay the same now? He is basically going to be used for fouls and to bang against some of the bigger teams in the league.
OG Sean -
Really, you would play Cardinal or Madsen over Smith? Really? What skill does Cardinal or Madsen bring? Love and Jefferson eat up the minutes at the PF AND C spots, not only the PF spot where Smith plays. Gomes played out of position at the 4 last year, he will get minutes at SF. The bigger question is where does Carney fit in the equation with Gomes on board? I believe if Gomes comes back, Carney will be gone soon enough, since it cost the Wolves zero to get him.
But really, Madsen and Cardinal over Smith? Come on now… be reasonable.
Would I play Cardinal or Madsen over Smith? Not generally. In certain situations? Yes. We know Wittman played Gomes ahead of Smith at PF on many occasions last year. Smith’s minutes are going to down. There’s really no need to have both Gomes and Smith around, given the other players we have.
I think we know where Carney fits — nowhere, if Gomes signs. The fact that the Wolves are apparently keen on keeping Gomes seems to signal that they aren’t sold on Carney being a productive member of the rotation.
Collins is widely known as the slowest human being in an NBA jersey, included the 400 pound guys in an old Glenn Robinson jersey watching Bucks games. He is a fouling machine who doesn’t rebound. The only times he’ll be used are when D-Ho, Yao, Shaq or Duncan are around. Otherwise is he useless.
Why are people touting his size ? He is horrible. Smith, Richard & Mad Dog before him!
Continuing on…Collins averages almost 3 fouls per 15 minutes of play for the last few years…does that sound like someone who can play D? Or does it look like the first guy used for a Hack-a-Shaq ?
As the Carney deal was shaking out, I thought McHale made a comment to the effect that the Wolves weren’t done dealing? Is that still the case?
Who is touting Collins’s D? All I said is that he can play something resembling NBA defense, which is something Smith hasn’t shown himself capable of. He routinely gets abused by bigger players.
I don’t think they’re close to any wheeling and dealing. They might do something as we get closer to camp, but i’m guessing the major fireworks are over
Sean - Insert “bad” after “resembling” and before “NBA defense.” This is why I am not completely opposed to bringing Richard back. This team doesn’t have high expectations this year, agreed ? I’d rather have him get minutes and try to become a good defensive player with that big body (although a little short) than to give Collins minutes just so Big Al can play the 4. The only times Collins deserves minutes on this squad is against a Shaq or Yao type so he can “beat em up”.
Collins is just the worst. Blaugh.
And regardless, I am guessing Richard would be one of the people we assign to the D-league again.
But forget Collins…I’d even rather have Mad Dog’s pesky D and hustle than Collins.
Collins and Booth are both horrible players who are only in the NBA because they are tall. Booth has never been able to break into a significant role and Collins can’t do anything but fill space. He can’t rebound as well as Smith, and only slightly better at blocking shots but being at least 4 inches taller helps. Meanwhile neither Collins or Booth can score or are energy players. So in most reguards they are tall slow Madsen’s (who puts up better numbers than Collins and is more disruptive) and Smith is a legit offensive force who is younger with room to grow.
If Collins is traded for the mysterious McHale player that can play the 1,2, and 3, Booth will be the designated big man to play the likes of Shaq or Yao.
If Collins stays, then my guess is Booth gets cut or used as a part in a another trade.
I think if McHale had to prefer between a guard heavy roster and a front court heavy roster, he would take the latter.
W + —- Yeah he does…do you really think McHale wants to sit around in an office everyday ? He likes working with big men and he is actually pretty good at it. Remember Rasho? Made him good and then when he was suspended for a year (Joe Smith fiasco) Rasho took a couple steps back until McHale was allowed to be around again.
